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  #1  
Old 02-14-2007, 10:47 PM
Steve Lindsay's Avatar
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Default Cut a practice plate together, Online

I'm wondering if it would be helpful if we were to cut a practice plate together? Here is the thought... I could draw up a simple scroll design, upload it and then people could download and transfer it to a practice plate. I would also transfer it to a plate and cut it with the video camera on and then upload the video. We could do it in sections... cutting outline , background removing and then shading... I'll start sketching a quick design that might work.

Steve
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  #2  
Old 02-14-2007, 11:08 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Sounds fun, My palm control should be here tomorrow.
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  #3  
Old 02-14-2007, 11:09 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Hi Barry.. Good!

Thought I'd post the rough sketch so that the drawing process can be seen. I like to draw with a .3mm pencil and HB lead. I sketch light to start with and as the design progresses I'll draw darker.


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Old 02-14-2007, 11:15 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

looks good...
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  #5  
Old 02-14-2007, 11:50 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Steve LETS GO for it, This Can be Fun as well as Informative,
Especially for us Out of Africe Types, I think that Jacques will also like it.
I would Especially like to See How You Do the Teardrop on the one Leave ?
When will You Finish the Practice 2 on Your first page?
I would REALLY like to see where You Start a cut and Where and How You Finish the Cut. I Have done it a few times in various sizes.

Guys With Steves Permission of Course, How About using this sketch of His, and Finish it Of Ourselves Putting in our own shading etc,
as well as what he suggests, Thus 2 Practice Plates !! Double the Fun.

ChrisB

Last edited by ChrisB; 02-14-2007 at 11:56 PM.
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  #6  
Old 02-14-2007, 11:53 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Hi Chris, Thanks, Maybe this could be tut #2 ... I let that one hang for a long time. I hope I don't go and leave this one hanging now... :willy_nilly:


Here is the drawing finished. Not pretty, but finished enough to know the plan for engraving it.

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  #7  
Old 02-15-2007, 12:01 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Next open the scanned image in photoshop and increase the contrast. The idea is to get rid of the grays so that we can print and transfer it easy. In photoshop click on Image/Adjustments/Levels... and play with the levels to increase the contrast. Here is what it looks like after that...
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Old 02-15-2007, 12:06 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Now in photoshop click on: Image/adjustments/Threshold... and adjust the threshold to turn it into nothing but black and white with no grays. Here is what it looks like after that...

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  #9  
Old 02-15-2007, 12:16 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Gees! that was Quick !
Don't You and Ray Sleep at Night I mean it is 9am here now.
Steve would this be full Size? as You Show.
Yup this would be Great as a Tut.

I must really Get to Use Coral, this looks so Quick!!, much Quicker than Having to trace my sketch over with AutCad.
O.K. I do use photshop Elements for my Photographs.:doh:
ChrisB.

Last edited by ChrisB; 02-15-2007 at 12:32 AM.
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  #10  
Old 02-15-2007, 12:33 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Chris, I like the idea about everyone sketching what they think would be best for a shading strategy. Maybe just draw the shading on a sheet of paper rather than cutting it though. Then after everyone posts their shading strategy each person can then decide how they would like to cut their shading.


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  #11  
Old 02-15-2007, 12:35 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

It is now ready to print and transfer to the plate. The actual size of the design we will aim for is .9" x .7". Don't print it huge to cover the whole practice plate! I have noticed at shows that people who are learning seem to engrave huge. It is much harder to engrave large than to engrave small! .. plus I find I can get more money for small delicate engavings than large bold stuff. So think small... I promise it will be easier to cut anyway. :thumbsup: Although the size of this engraving is still somewhat large to what I'm doing on the knife and watch engravings, but it is small compared to what I see beginners sometimes engrave.

The file print size including the white space around the design is: .906" x 1"

The design will need to be flipped over before printing and transfered so that it won't be a mirror to the one I'll cut in a video. I have flipped the image and saved it as a tiff file. A tiff file retains the print size. You should be able to download it, open it in your favorite paint program and just click print.

Here is the link to the Tiff file... Right click on it and select "save target as"
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  #12  
Old 02-15-2007, 01:08 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

I finished cutting the plate. The file is 15 minutes long and 478 megs big. I tried to upload it at www.youtube.com but it said files have to be under 100 megs. The file is a mpg and I'm looking for a splitter to break it up into 5 chunks. Anyone know of a video utility that will do this?
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  #13  
Old 02-15-2007, 03:29 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

This is a great idea! It's something I've wanted to see for years but no ones done it till now.
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  #14  
Old 02-15-2007, 03:47 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Steve, I found This While You Where Sleeping,
Might Be Of Help ?

www.freedownloadscenter.com/Search/splitter.html

ChrisB.
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  #15  
Old 02-15-2007, 06:48 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Hi Steve,
Here is my Rendition of the Shading. :D
Will try and cut the outline this evening. (15min)?
ChrisB.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Lindsaytut1.jpg (100.5 KB, 913 views)

Last edited by ChrisB; 02-15-2007 at 06:57 AM.
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  #16  
Old 02-15-2007, 07:32 AM
Ken Hurst Ken Hurst is offline
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Well done Steve, I think you've got a great idea for helping new engravers. This should get them rolling rather fast. ken
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  #17  
Old 02-15-2007, 07:35 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Now this Steve is the beginning of a school of engraving on the web site. I think it is great. Trying to Keep up with you will be the big problem,Ha Jack
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  #18  
Old 02-15-2007, 08:02 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Thanks guys, The file is now split into five.

I am using a PalmControl to cut the plate.
Here is a link to the videos...

Something that is noticeable through the videos is that I speed up after I get warmed up. I find I do this with shading too. I'll start out slower in the morning and after a few minutes into it I'm up to speed.

When ending a cut that has any depth to it, always pop the chip out at the end. If you don't, you'll leave the chip standing up which will cause blood to flow from your finger if you run into it. The exception to popping or flicking out the chip is when a gradual taper is desired at the tail end and then we will want to power out. The tapering or powering out movement is similar to the end of an ice-cream scoop action. I tried to describe this in an earlier beginner video tutorial. The videos at the top that earlier tutorial page illustrate powering out to create a tapered tail end.

As Mike mentioned in another thread titled "jumping the ditch", the chip should also be popped out when intersecting a line to prevent crashing into the other side and causing damage to it. In the middle of the Brannen Brothers flute logo engraving video I begin the block lettering. It is an example which illustrates the situation Mike describes. To engrave the block letters more efficiently, first, I use a flat graver without a heel just to stab and square up the ends. Then I use a V graver and intersect the stabs. I time the cut right and just short of intersecting the line I flick the chip out so that it breaks into the intersecting line or stab cut. Another method to prevent jumping the ditch is to just power it through into the intersecting cut but this isn't as fast because you have to be more careful not to go too far. Either way will work though.

Steve
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  #19  
Old 02-15-2007, 08:39 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

This is an excelelnt idea Steve. :thumbsup:
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  #20  
Old 02-15-2007, 09:16 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

O.K.
I did it in 30min.
I spend more time trying to get a good Photo !!
Then I scanned it. Hope it is O.K. I mean the picture.

Also A picture of part of my Workshop, I cant Call it a Studio, as im a Knifemaker, and the Boss won't allow any work inside the House. I Tried.
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File Type: jpg Workshop.jpg (77.0 KB, 877 views)
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  #21  
Old 02-15-2007, 09:19 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisB
Hi Steve,
Here is my Rendition of the Shading. :D
Will try and cut the outline this evening. (15min)?
ChrisB.


Your shading strategy looks like what I'd do too. There are lots of different ways to shade the same leaf or design... None wrong or right. I sometimes sketch in shading on a sheet of paper if I have a question in my head what I want to do with a particular leaf. You might sketch more ideas for the heck of it and see if you like another version for one ore more of the leaves or vines.
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  #22  
Old 02-15-2007, 09:28 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisB
O.K.
I did it in 30min.
I spend more time trying to get a good Photo !!
Then I scanned it. Hope it is O.K. I mean the picture.

Also A picture of part of my Workshop, I cant Call it a Studio, as im a Knifemaker, and the Boss won't allow any work inside the House. I Tried.
You have a boss too? When my boss and I were married, she said I could have the whole living room to set my shop in. But I went down stairs and built it down there so I could have the engraving shop next to the metal shop. Years later, I asked if I could place an engraving bench in the living room and now she says NO! She has it full of music, piano, flute and stuff on the walls that I don't fully understand. Just kidding here.. We get a long great but she is fun to tease!
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  #23  
Old 02-15-2007, 10:34 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

very cool!

I will have to wait until later, as I am almost done my lunch break!

Tom
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  #24  
Old 02-15-2007, 10:37 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisB
O.K.
I did it in 30min.
I spend more time trying to get a good Photo !!
Then I scanned it. Hope it is O.K. I mean the picture.
Chris, It looks good to me! Shop looks good too...and you have windows! It is 7 degrees this morning here. What is the temperature there in South Africa today?
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  #25  
Old 02-15-2007, 11:39 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

:willy_nilly: :willy_nilly:
For some its an ok for others is an OK!!
I think its a good idea.
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Old 02-15-2007, 11:43 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Say, maybe you could also post "a sticky" on how to post pictures in a quote and how to link to a site and thus post more pics.
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Old 02-15-2007, 11:54 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny C
Say, maybe you could also post "a sticky" on how to post pictures in a quote and how to link to a site and thus post more pics.
Okay... thanks Danny. Done!
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  #28  
Old 02-15-2007, 12:07 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

this is great steve .is there a way to download the videos my internet is rather slow and it pauses while i watch.

Last edited by jacques herbst; 02-18-2007 at 01:03 PM.
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  #29  
Old 02-15-2007, 12:52 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Thanks Steve
Great idea, will have to give it a try
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  #30  
Old 02-15-2007, 03:12 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Well, I'm not proud of it, but here's mine....
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  #31  
Old 02-15-2007, 03:41 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Cowles
Well, I'm not proud of it, but here's mine....

Looks good to me Don! Thanks for joining the cutting party
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  #32  
Old 02-15-2007, 05:04 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Quote:
Originally Posted by jacques herbst
this is great steve .is there a way to download the videos my internet is rather slow and it pauses while i watch.
I'm not seeing a way that www.youtube.com lets us download videos to our harddrive. I haven't used the site very much though... so maybe I'm just not seeing the right button that lets us download.

Steve
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  #33  
Old 02-15-2007, 05:54 PM
dan mitchell dan mitchell is offline
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Steve,

As a novice engraver I think this is fantastic. I can't thank you enough for taking the time out of your busy schedule
to put together these great tutorials. In addition, I did receive my upgraded Palm Control and it is absolutly flawless. Nice meeting you in Reno.

Thanks,

Dan
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  #34  
Old 02-15-2007, 05:57 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Thank you Dan for your kindness. Glad you're liking the updated bore! Steve
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Old 02-15-2007, 06:07 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Steve I'm having problems trying to save the scroll. It wants me to buy some program. Any ideas? :willy_nilly: :willy_nilly:
David
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  #36  
Old 02-15-2007, 06:12 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Hi Steve,
Just as a reference what type of graver do you use in the video. I would assume you are using a 120 deg. Carbalt? Also what stroke settings are you using. From the sound in the video it appears to be a rather long stroke. ( that or it's a g*****max. :willy_nilly: ) I'm just curious as to what type of stroke you prefer for this type of work. I think that at times I use too fine of a stroke.
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Old 02-15-2007, 06:25 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Quote:
Originally Posted by KDavid
Steve I'm having problems trying to save the scroll. It wants me to buy some program. Any ideas? :willy_nilly: :willy_nilly:
David

Hi David, Boy.... I don't know.. What program does it want you to buy? Are your right clicking or left clicking? Be sure to use the right button. Is that it?
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  #38  
Old 02-15-2007, 06:56 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy
Hi Steve,
Just as a reference what type of graver do you use in the video. I would assume you are using a 120 deg. Carbalt? Also what stroke settings are you using. From the sound in the video it appears to be a rather long stroke. ( that or it's a g*****max. :willy_nilly: ) I'm just curious as to what type of stroke you prefer for this type of work. I think that at times I use too fine of a stroke.

Hi Andy... You're funny

The graver point was a 116.68 degree point that Paul and I decided was best for the universal template for his sharpener. This is the angle of the presharpened gravers that are currently sent out with the tools.

While cutting the outlines I had the stroke adjustment set so that half of the first exhaust hole was showing and just the start of the next two holes. Air pressure was set around 40 PSI. Here is a pic of the bottom of the tool so that the amount of the three exhaust holes can be seen.

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Old 02-15-2007, 07:16 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Next step is removing background.
I opened the image up in photoshop and used the fill bucket to show what background we will be removing.


As a side note, if part of this were to be inlayed in gold, now would be the time to do that. When I only want parts of the scroll in gold but I cant't decide which parts, I use a yellow pencil on paper or the fill bucket in photoshop to help decide. Open the image in photoshop and select yellow color and then simply click on various stems or leaves to fill them with yellow. Once that is decided, start cutting away those sections and undercutting. Although when cutting away for gold stop short of cutting into the outline of the leaf. Here is a sketch of what I mean...


I won't be inlaying gold in this practice plate. However, if gold were inlayed as I tried to describe above, after going through the sanding grits the next step is simply to scoot the graver in the original V outline cuts that are still around the gold. There will be small pieces of gold laying there that doesn't take much but sliding the V graver around the outline to clean it out. From this point the project is the same as if you didn't inlay gold. Just remove background and shade.


I'll be using the dental air drill handpiece made by NSK to cut away and stipple the background.
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  #40  
Old 02-15-2007, 07:47 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Steve,

This is GREAT I will get started on this.

P.S. My new PalmControl is Purrrrrrrfect I love it.
Tom White
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Old 02-15-2007, 08:58 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Hi, John from Oklahoma here:
It see it doesn't pay to miss a couple of days, Valentines day is tough on us Jewelers, I don't have photoshop, so I saved it to Microsoft Word, it worked great Printed easy -(for the member having problems) , Now to get the time to cut, Maybe tomorrow. Great Idea Steve
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  #42  
Old 02-15-2007, 09:58 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

OOPs, didn't know we were removing background. Almost finished with the outline...

Time for bed though.

This is fun!

Tom
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  #43  
Old 02-15-2007, 11:53 PM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Hi Steve,
Thanks for the remarks, Yes We All Have Bosses, Whether it is Your Partner in life or the Grandchildren, Some guys may Deny it in public, but visit them and see.:yesnod:
Yup my shop actually has two windows, The pots You see in the pic thru the window is another passion of mine I dable in Orchids.
the temp here in the evenings, that photo was taken at about 5pm. 28deg C(82F) mornings about 8-12C.(46F) We have Summer here now and the Temp will be Around 30-32C(90F) this Weekend they say.

Will be Getting back to it over the weekend.
ChrisB.

Last edited by ChrisB; 02-16-2007 at 12:35 AM.
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  #44  
Old 02-16-2007, 02:55 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Steve,
A Big Please !! I dont know whether the other guys are experiancing the same.!!
Can You Please put these Videos on Your Site like in Tut1

YouTube Sucks!! When I eventually get connected, And I did Register,!!
the first one takes about 14min to complete !! You Stop So many Times that I cant Follow anything.
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  #45  
Old 02-16-2007, 08:06 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Chris, Are you on a dial up connection? That would make things run slow. The videos are 100 megs each and need a fast connection. Are other videos besides at youtube.com slow for you too? Hey, try going to goggle videos and watch various videos there and see if that works better for you. If so, I could upload them there. http://video.google.com/?ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en&tab=wv&q=
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  #46  
Old 02-16-2007, 08:38 AM
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHN COTHERN
Hi, John from Oklahoma here:
It see it doesn't pay to miss a couple of days, Valentines day is tough on us Jewelers, I don't have photoshop, so I saved it to Microsoft Word, it worked great Printed easy -(for the member having problems) , Now to get the time to cut, Maybe tomorrow. Great Idea Steve
Hi John, That is good to know that a tiff file will print fine from msword!

Glad you survived Valentines day at the jewelry store!
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  #47  
Old 02-16-2007, 10:06 AM
Tim C Tim C is offline
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Location: Cutler Bay, So. Florida
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

Steve,
Great idea !!!
I'm in, just that I work slowly.

I don't have the programs yet to do all the transfer stuff but trying to download the finished pictures from here.
Now if I can remember, where did I put those practice plates?
Tim
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  #48  
Old 02-16-2007, 10:54 AM
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Steve Lindsay Steve Lindsay is offline
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together

I was planning on recording background removal this morning however something came up. I'll try and do that tonight and upload the video.

Steve
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  #49  
Old 02-16-2007, 10:39 PM
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Tom McArdle Tom McArdle is offline
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

here is my shot at it...



Cut some a bit bold. Didn't realize we were going to take out the background. Cut a little lighter when finishing tonight.

Thanks Steve!

take care,

Tom

PS I cut this with a FOOT PEDAL, SINGLE REGULATOR OLD AIRGRAVER!

:D
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  #50  
Old 02-16-2007, 11:56 PM
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ChrisB ChrisB is offline
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Default Re: Cut a practice plate together, Online

Gravertom,
I'm Glad to hear there is still SOME OLD School Airgravers out There Very Nicely Done.
Steve I tried the Videos at work, They have a Permanent Connection, At home Dial up Even Worse, Can I buy a CD from You.?
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